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 Post subject: A Monument to Strength
PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 6:49 am 
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First of all, why is Rhonas' Monument in a foreign language?
To those unfamiliar with the card:

Green creature spells you cast cost 1 less to cast.
Whenever you cast a creature spell, target creature you control gets +2/+2 and gains trample until end of turn.


Been toying with Rhonas' Monument and its fast kill possibilities. This deck is the best i came up with. The Deck is solid and fast. More of farming deck as far as I can tell. Whether it can dominate in the ladder is another thing entirely. I can see it able to compete with Naya. It could be too fast for control. Dont have the time to test it though.

The idea is, Drop the Rhonas' Monument and beat the s**t off your enemy by dropping creatures and making those on the board bigger and badder. There will be no hiding behind puny blockers, Trample assures that.
Any and all advise are welcomed


2x Greenbelt Rampager Cast it three times since you dont have the Energy to pay for it, thats 3x +2/+2 with trample
3x Blossoming Defense So they dont die that easily

1x Sylvan Advocate Green goodstuff
3x Longtusk Cub Can grow in size, can eat Energy so you can cast Greenbelt Rampager forever
4x Elvish Visionary Good old Elf Draw, disposable body
2x Smuggler's Copter Has evasion and will help filter the deck

1x Trophy Mage Can help fetch Rhonas' Monument, a possible discard for copter, might need to drop it to just 1
1x Nissa, Vastwood Seer Mana and possible draw card
1x Rhonas the Indomitable Easy to turn online due to Rhonas' Monument
2x Tireless Tracker Green goodstuff and draw
2x Prowling Serpopard Protection against control and big damage output
3x Bounding Krasis A great tempo card that replaces Pack Guardian plus a built in tap/untap effect
3x Rogue Refiner Helps with draw, good body and can help Longtusk Cub. Sac him for Elder Deep-Fiend to activate Rhonas' Monument
3x Rhonas' Monument THE MONUMENT

1x Kiora, Master of the Depths Best draw PW for the deck or to untap creatures that attacked

2x Outland Colossus Imagine Outland Colossus buffed with Rhonas' Monument, 'nuff said.
2x Elder Deep-Fiend The mother of all tempo cards. A good blocker and body

9x Forest
6x Island
2x Hinterland Harbor
2x Lumbering Falls
3x Aether Hub

Updated


Last edited by butete09 on Fri May 05, 2017 12:12 am, edited 5 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 12:51 pm 
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Nice. I was thinking about building around some of the monuments. Green and White in particular (but also thinking about using the blue one in a green creature deck just to keep opps board tapped down).

List looks pretty interesting. I'd prob cut Terrain Elemental tho. Would replace with Longtusk Cubs (+2 and trample to get that energy trigger and keep pumping), or maybe +1 Recruiter +1 Lambholt Pacifist. Terrain Elemental only seems worth it in an Elemental Bond deck where you need a critical mass of 3 power creatures, imo.

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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 12:55 pm 
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do you care about curving from 1 drop? No. Could add red and haste elements to the deck. Will look very cool.

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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 4:58 pm 
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do you care about curving from 1 drop? No. Could add red and haste elements to the deck. Will look very cool.


One thing about haste and the Monuments is that the Monuments trigger on cast, not ETB, so they won't be able to target the creatures that trigger them, limiting the interaction with hasty creeps and Rhonas's.


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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 5:56 pm 
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wow... I didn't notice that. In the pre-release I used the monument and Samut. Every creature I played had haste and +2/+2 themselves. Guess I cheated.

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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 9:04 pm 
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In my test games, I had only used Recruiter's draw ability in one game. Adding another one doesnt make sense, but a Lambholt Pacifist or a Longtusk Cub makes a lot of sense. Forgot they can grow in size. The cub can be useful as well in eating Energy counters so I can cast Greenbelt Rampager forever!


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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 10:58 am 
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If the first goal of this deck is to drop Rhonas' Monument, have you already thought to include trophy mage even if it isn't a green card ?


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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 12:03 pm 
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How has it been playing? One thing I'd worry about with Monuments is running out of gas, and I'd want to have a lot of ways to keep drawing creatures. Visionaries and Recruiters as you've got, plus more.

I haven't tried your version yet so maybe it doesn't need these types of changes, but I'm thinking something like this:

3 x Blossoming Defense
2 x Greenbelt Rampager
3 x Longtusk Cub
2 x Sylvan Advocate
4 x Elvish Visionary
3 x Duskwatch Recruiter
2 x Smuggler's Copter
3 x Rogue Refiner
3 x Bounding Krasis
2 x Tireless Tracker
3 x Rhonas's Monument
1 x Rhonas the Indomitable
2 x Bristling Hydra
1 x Kiora, Master of the Depths
2 x Elder Deep-Fiend
3 x Aether Hub
3 x Evolving Wilds
2 x Lumbering Falls
2 x Hinterland Harbor
8 x Forest
6 x Island


Maybe need to work in Baral's Expertise. Forest/Island quantities maybe need a tweak. But something like that.

Refiner and Kiora to double up on Visionary and Recruiter effects to keep gassed up. Krasis for utility in instant speed pumps (opp thought it was safe to attack because your doods are tapped down? What if you could make it a trap and buff a tapped dood +2 and untap them on defense?), plus could tap down a larger blocker to make sure you keep hitting. Deep-Fiend too for tapping down board and getting surprise pumps (emerging off Visionaries/Refiners/Krasis who've done their job already). Extra energy from Refiners and Hubs help Cubs too.

If the deck is too reliant on Monuments and it's hard to get them even with the extra draw power, a Trophy Mage or two could slot right in.

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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2017 9:28 pm 
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In my experience you dont need to play Rhonas' Monument to win. But TBH the Monument makes it almost imposible to loose. The set as it is has enough draw to win before you ran out of gas. But i like the suggestions regarding adding blue for more gas in case the deck faces a control deck armed to the teeth with counters and trophy mage doesnt seem so bad. Let me give it a spin.


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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 11:13 am 
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I want to give your monogreen version a run to see how it is with Crocks and gearhulk and such, but I threw my Simic version together and tested 4 games (2 AI, 2 Ladder).

In AI games I didn't draw Monument at all, but was still able to win by being able to play out creatures quickly and got some energy things going with Cubs. I made the change -1 Duskwatch Recruiter, +1 Trophy Mage and took it in the ladder. Of course after adding Trophy Mage, I had Monument in my opening hand both ladder games... ended up beating an Orzombie deck that curved out pretty well, but I was able to swarm them by dumping out my hand thanks to all the draw in the deck and Monument making all my creature spells cost 1-2 mana. Won with 4 life left thanks to the Greenbelt Rampager trick pumping a bunch of doods +2 Trample. G2 I played a Boros Humans/Exert deck and won thanks to Deepfiend tapping down all the blockers on endstep, clearing way for lethal attack.

What I like about the idea - Rhonas's Monument is a ton of fun. It's very powerful with all the drawing the deck can do, and cheapening the cost of all the creatures (save Deepfiend/Mage) lets you play out several creatures each turn (lessening the pain of opp packing instant speed removal, being able to spread +2s across several bodies). It made me sad the games I didn't draw Monument, because having it out is such a blast.

What I'd like to improve about the idea - interaction. I think I might have lost the game vs Boros if not for drawing Deepfiend, and playing a Krasis to tap down a Fan Bearer helped me win the Orzombies game (but that's 5 cards total in the deck and they don't remove, just manipulate). I was able to use my creatures as a form of removal by pumping one I didn't care about (like Visionarys) and tossing it to certain death just to chip away at blockers (fine for me because the deck draws very well so my resources accumulate faster), but there were times I'd get nervous and things would feel shakey not being able to target creatures for removal (like when the zombie deck got a lord out). Maybe do need to work those Expertises in, and/or some green fight-style removal spells.

Deck can def do some very fun stuff tho. I did get a kick out of playing it.

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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 6:45 pm 
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I made a Mono-Green deck. I feel so dirty... :blush:

But this thread gave me an idea, this is the perfect deck for elemental bonds!

Just play big dumb creatures, draw a sh@tload of cards, play more dumb creatures and win... That's why I went with mono-green, to keep it simple. You can easily go Gruul, but that's what everyone else is playing...

So here's the list:
Mono-Green Stampede
Creature(24)
2 x Greenbelt Rampager
3 x Lambholt Pacifist
4 x Druid of the Cowl
2 x Tireless Tracker
2 x Prowling Serpopard
1 x Rhonas the Indomitable
3 x Pack Guardian
2 x Bristling Hydra
2 x Crocodile of the Crossing
2 x Seed Guardian
1 x Verdurous Gearhulk

Split(2)
2 x Mouth

Enchantment(3)
3 x Elemental Bond

Planeswalker(1)
1 x Nissa, Vital Force

Artifact(5)
1 x Heart of Kiran
3 x Rhonas's Monument
1 x Skysovereign, Consul Flagship


Land(25)
23x Forest
1x Westvale Abbey
1x Rogue's Passage

To view this deck go to: https://www.magicduelshelper.com/deckli ... 32031ef256

Created using Magic Duels Helper: http://www.magicduelshelper.com

There is a bit if tech in there, with heart and Skysovereign to help out against flyers. Mouth is just another 3/3 body, but feed is fuel. Seed Guardian also helps against flyers and gives sone sweeper resilience, because you will end up with a graveyard full of creatures and sweepers may wreck you...

Just get the bonds and Monument out asap.

Also, be careful not to deck yourself.

Enjoy!

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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 8:47 pm 
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Drew some inspiration from my green deck there Haven? :V Or just great minds thinking alike?
Some interesting creature choices.. although they all still trigger Bond or Rhonas, or both- which is what we want.

Rhonas's Monument is something I had completely overlooked however. Combining it with flipped Pacifist is an interesting alternative to ramp spells.

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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:11 am 
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I dont think it needs additional interaction. My deck runs with 2 Deep Fiend and 3 Bounding Krasis. And in my games thats more than enough to deal with opponents. Most of the time with Rhonas' Monument in play the creatures are too big for them to deal with already. I just use the tap effect to force them to sac a lord or that important creature as a blocker.

Try using my build with Outland Colossus, only played it 4 times in ladder and hasn't lost yet. In two of them i got Outland colossus to attack. After it becomes as 12/12 my opponent auto quits. Against AI it only lost once with mana flood in ten games. So weird i drew 11 lands and 4 non lands.

Adding made the deck a whole lot faster and better. The crocs and gearhulk were good but they were predictable. Changing them with krasis and deepfiend was worth it.

SadlyElemental bond doesnt work for this deck. I ran your deck and had a great time with Elemental Bond. Ramp deck really loves that card. Seed Guardian can be replaced by Outland Colossus. A colossus with trample via Monument can end the game.


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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 8:06 am 
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I love the combo with Greenbelt Rampager and Longtusk Cub... if you get those along with Rhonas's Monument in your opening hand there is potential to swing for 13/13 trample on turn 4!!!

I tried a modified version of the original mono green version; after making several substitutions for my current card pool (I have 100% KAL/AER/AKH and 60% ORI), I found myself adding a sub theme with the trials and cartouches; along with Herald of the Pantheon there's lots of fun to be had there.

One card that seems out of place (I initially put it in as filler, but it's been surprisingly not as bad as I thought it would be) is Greenwheel Liberator. Between the Rampager, trials/cartouches, and Croc/Visionary, it can get the Revolt pretty often. Or if not, it can also be a snack for Croc.

I'm not a great deck builder; probably some junk in here but I'm open to constructive critique. It beats down the AI pretty quickly and consistently, not that that necissarily is an accomplishment.

Deck List

Creature(22):
2x Greenbelt Rampager
2x Elvish Visionary
2x Herald of the Pantheon
2x Undercity Troll
3x Longtusk Cub
2x Greenwheel Liberator
2x Prowling Serpopard
1x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
1x Rhona the Indomitable
2x Bristling Hydra
3x Crocodile of the Crossing

Instant(3):
3x Blossoming Defense

Split(2):
2x Mouth // Feed

Enchantment(7):
4x Cartouche of Strength
3x Trial of Strength

Artifacts(3):
3x Rhonas's Monument

Lands(23):
23x Forest


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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 8:48 am 
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Herald of the Pantheon is one of those card that seem very good on paper but in truth is not worth the space. There are better two drops you can use. It makes enchantments cheaper but you only need one enchantment and the Monument is a legendary. Also life gain is not needed for this deck. A couple of sets ago when Planeswalker enchantments deck arrived at duels Meta, we tried using Herald of the Pantheon bec it seemed the deck is made for it but even in that deck we ended up cutting it.

Greenwheel Liberator wont be optimal as well bec you need a revolt to trigger before you get it as a bigger creature otherwise you are paying for a 2/1 creature. That means you need to cast it most of the times after combat ends, a wasted damage and trample from the Monument. The deck works best if you have a lot of green creatures you can cast. I opted to remove Mouth // Feed from my list as well for that same reason.

Dont worry about making crappy decks, everyone does it. Thats why NGA exists so we can share ideas and learn from one another. Try using the new version i updated if you have the cards for it. It works faster and can compete in the ladder. Five wins to 1 loss as of the moment. Only loss i got was from a rakdos madness deck that was way too fast for any green deck without a kill spell.

Nice work with Undercity Troll i actually considered using it when i was making the deck. The subtheme i wanted to go was Reknown. Valeron Wardens a go to card draw when Origins arrived. I was planning on making it an deck with all creatures having in them. But got carried away and forgot about it until today.


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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 10:17 am 
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The Greenwheel Liberator has been hitting Revolt before combat more often than you'd think, between recalling the Trials, bouncing the Rampager, and feeding a Visionary to the Croc. But if I got rid of the Cartouche/Trial theme, that would definitely leave with it.

The thought with Mouth // Feed was really for the Feed part, in case I run out of gas. But I rarely found a situation where Mouth was worth it over another card I was holding in my hand, so you're right, it probably needs to go. If I go simic, there are gonna be much better draw options.

Has baby Nissa been working for anyone else? I was thinking of cutting it because by turn 7, I'm usually in a winning position already anyways; holding on to it hasn't really ever turned around a game for me, and playing it earlier is pretty meh. What about the new Simic Nissa though? It seems like Scry 2 is never unwelcome...


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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:49 pm 
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On a somewhat unrelated note, Longtusk Cub is worth running for the flavor text alone.


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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:57 pm 
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If you keep the Revolt subtheme with the enchantment i guess that would work. I just consider Baby Nissa as a draw a land with a 2/2 body. For that price it is a worthy addition. Also the draw land has helped me get that extra land i need a lot of times. Ive only flipped it once TBH but few games ever go that long so i dont really look into that. I just consider it a cherry on the cake if it does happen. Nissa became better when i added blue. There are games when i only had 1 green mana and she helped in securing a second one. She was in the chopping block when i was using mono green.


I ran reknown deck last night. It was slow. And i cant hardly draw any card bec by the time i had the reknown cards in play the game has gone on too long and hitting face became harder. I lost twice to AI in six games. And none of it was due to mana flood. It was just too slow and that lack of speed allowed them to control the board before I can produce threats.


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