It is currently Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:01 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 10:59 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Dec 19, 2015
Posts: 1623

_________________
My decks can be found in my deckbuilder archive. Enter here!


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:18 am 
Online
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 25, 2013
Posts: 3348
Had a pile that felt like a surefire 1-3 or maybe 3-3 and after a pair of opponents suddently surrendering in the middle of the match got 7-2, not sure of what it did right, feels like a pile, maybe I just got carried by the removal

Creatures

Nef-crop entangler
channeler initiate
pathmaker initiate
initiate's companion

khenra charioteer
pouncing cheetah
ornery kudu
minotaur sureshotx3

hyena pack
giant spider
quarry hauler

desert cerodonx3

Plus another copy of one creature, not sure what one, pretty sure it was a 3 or a 4 drop, guessing cheetah or sureshoot.

Noncreature

shed weakness
cut//ribbons
Spidery grasp
Electrify
Deem worthy
Heaven//Earth

Lands
8 forest
8 mountain
1 cradle of the accursed

Currently at 3 7-x(WR,WU,GR) and a 5-3(WB) somehow


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:03 pm 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 929
Why would you draft Gust Walker over Gideon? Gideon is good on the offense and on the defense, while Gust Walker only ever works in aggressive decks. Like, Gust Walker is clearly a good card but I don't see how it can compare to Gideon. Besides, with a wipe coming, rare drafting doesn't make sense.

Also I'm quite envious at all the 7-0 streaks :(


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 12:42 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Dec 19, 2015
Posts: 1623
Banedon wrote:
Why would you draft Gust Walker over Gideon? Gideon is good on the offense and on the defense, while Gust Walker only ever works in aggressive decks. Like, Gust Walker is clearly a good card but I don't see how it can compare to Gideon. Besides, with a wipe coming, rare drafting doesn't make sense.


Gust Walker is good in every deck. It's clear why he is good on offense; in a defensive deck you need 2-drops to stave off aggression, and Gust Walker is a 2-drop that isn't dead late-game (great Exert clause). Many people think he's the second best common in the set after Magma Spray, and I tend to agree (Compulsory Rest is a tad worse than him since most creatures are small and the games often turn into a race, Final Reward is very expensive (but good at what it does), Cartouche of Strength may be the closest contender for second best common).

Gideon is your choice of a 3-mana 4/4 that can't block or a 0/X wall that chooses who it has to block on your turn; and if you're behind on board you will lose him very easily at very little cost for the opponent. Most of us actually made the mistake and greatly overestimated Gideon when he was first spoiled (he looks REALLY good at first glance; 3 mana walker with a "you can't lose the game" clause?), in practice he plays out quite a bit worse.

_________________
My decks can be found in my deckbuilder archive. Enter here!


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 2:03 am 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 929
Well I certainly felt that Gideon was overrated too, but at the time I was playing Duels, and this Gideon is in no way comparable to Gideon, Ally of Zendikar. Also in a constructed environment things are different. It's true that Gust Walker is arguably the second-best common, but that doesn't mean anything, since Gideon is a mythic and there should be plenty of mythics / rares / uncommons better than the second best common. I feel like you understate Gideon's strengths quite a bit:

Gideon is a 3-mana 4/4 that's indestructible. That means you can't trade against it, you can't deathtouch it, etc.
When defending, Gideon is somewhat of a 0/X wall, but also a bit more than that. First he gains you life - the opponent must attack Gideon. Second, he can "block" flying creatures or even unblockable ones, plus he blocks trample & lifelink.
Finally, if you are so far behind that you lose him easily at little cost to opponent, then you are probably dead anyway since opponent can just swing at your face. The opponent also needs to take out Gideon without their best attacker.

Let's say I have Gideon and you have Colossapede. Usually this means I'm on the defense, as I should be, since I have a 3-mana card while you have a 5-mana card. But for me this is actually even better than a stalemate: neither of us can attack, but my Gideon's steadily gaining in loyalty.

I genuinely don't see how they're comparable. Sure Gust Walker is a great card, but compared to Gideon I'm taking Gideon every time.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 3:15 am 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 929
Okay so I finally scrounged up enough gold for another draft, time to document it so I don't flunk out again :D

P1P1: I open Plague Belcher and pick it over not much else. The next best card in the pact is Splendid Agony. Plague Belcher should be a 3/2 menace for 3 at worst which is still quite good.
P1P2: Bone Picker vs. Cartouche of Strength with other notable cards Emberhorn Minotaur, Tah-Crop Elite and Trueheart Duelist. I take Bone Picker since I'm already in black.
P1P3: Trial of Knowledge vs. Baleful Amnit vs. Fan Bearer, take Baleful Amnit since once again I'm in black. There're other black playables like Unburden and Doomed Dissenter but those should be lower down the pick order. I clearly need creatures to put -1/-1 counters on.
P1P4: Naga Vitalist vs. Cartouche of Solidarity vs. Doomed Dissenter. What's the pick?


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 6:09 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Dec 19, 2015
Posts: 1623
Banedon wrote:
Let's say I have Gideon and you have Colossapede. Usually this means I'm on the defense, as I should be, since I have a 3-mana card while you have a 5-mana card. But for me this is actually even better than a stalemate: neither of us can attack, but my Gideon's steadily gaining in loyalty.


The scenario you described is at parity. At parity, Gideon is okay; when ahead he's the 4/4 attacker you described.
The problem is what happens when you're behind. Say the opponent did not have a Colossapede, but two medium-sized creatures (say, 2 Unwavering Initiate). Suddenly Gideon fights a losing battle, you may be forced to take bad blocks to protect him or have him go down, whereas a simple creature (maybe even a Gust Walker) would do better in that situation.

Gideon may be a Mythic, but even Mythic power levels greatly vary (Glorious End says hi). Gideon is not THAT bad, but there's a fair share of Commons and Uncommons I'd take over him, and Gust Walker definitely is one of them.

Banedon wrote:
Okay so I finally scrounged up enough gold for another draft, time to document it so I don't flunk out again :D

P1P1: I open Plague Belcher and pick it over not much else. The next best card in the pact is Splendid Agony. Plague Belcher should be a 3/2 menace for 3 at worst which is still quite good.
P1P2: Bone Picker vs. Cartouche of Strength with other notable cards Emberhorn Minotaur, Tah-Crop Elite and Trueheart Duelist. I take Bone Picker since I'm already in black.
P1P3: Trial of Knowledge vs. Baleful Amnit vs. Fan Bearer, take Baleful Amnit since once again I'm in black. There're other black playables like Unburden and Doomed Dissenter but those should be lower down the pick order. I clearly need creatures to put -1/-1 counters on.
P1P4: Naga Vitalist vs. Cartouche of Solidarity vs. Doomed Dissenter. What's the pick?


Looks like a solid draft so far. With what you have, I believe I'd just pick Doomed Dissenter; it works really well with basically all of the cards you already have. Naga Vitalist is better in a nutshell IMO; but you don't necessarily have to end up in Green. Cartouche of Solidarity is okay, but not a huge signal for White and Dissenter is probably just better for your deck.

_________________
My decks can be found in my deckbuilder archive. Enter here!


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 2:17 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Dec 19, 2015
Posts: 1623
Had two more quick 7-2s; too lazy to upload the screenies. One was RG Monsters (I was surprised to see that deck make 7; not complaining mind you), one was RW Aggro (that one went 6-0 before I had to mulligan against a really good RB deck, then squared off twice against the same UW player).

My current deck may become my worst performer of AKH draft. I'm GBw, cutting it very close on playables (splashing White for Ahn-Crop Champion to make 23, and that includes double Dune Beetle, which is not at its best in that deck). No real bombs aside from a Decimator Beetle either. Sitting at 1-2 (my worst decks during AKH Quick were two 4-3s with Simic).

_________________
My decks can be found in my deckbuilder archive. Enter here!


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:05 am 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 929
Well, I took Naga Vitalist because it felt like it had much better upside than Doomed Dissenter. It also carries a -1/-1 counter reasonably. Having to venture into another colour is not so good though, and come to think of it now, the Dissenter can carry two -1/-1 counters while Naga can only carry one.

P1P5: literally no black cards, but a couple of green ones. Took Bitterblade Warrior instead of Ornery Kudu, reasoning that it's both a slightly superior card + if I have to give the Warrior -1/-1, it can still exert and force a trade.
P1P6: Wasteland Scorpion over Seeker of Insight, Pathmaker Initiate, Honed Kopesh, Bontu's Monument, Spidery Grasp. Scorpion just seems like the most solid card, and it's in my colour too.
P1P7: there's Supernatural Stamina, Miasmic Mummy and Shed Weakness. Pick Shed Weakness because it works with my -1/-1 counters, and so far my creatures' ETB abilities are bad. Mummy looks like the weakest card to me since its effect is not so good, and it's just a bear otherwise.
P1P8: another Wasteland Scorpion vs. Ornery Kudu. Scorpion looks obvious. Surely it's being undervalued by the AI here (or black is just open?).
P1P9: Hekma Sentinels, River Serpent, Festering Mummy, Manticore of the Gauntlet. Take Mummy since it's black and takes -1/-1 counters about as well as Doomed Dissenter. It's also a zombie that triggers Plague Belcher. The other cards can be better but they aren't in my colours.
P1P10: another Festering Mummy over Cancel.
P1P11: Unburden over River Serpent.
P1P12: three off-colour cards Open Into Wonder, Mighty Leap and Naga Oracle. Take Mighty Leap since it works well with my creatures and it's more splashable than Open into Wonder.
Rest of the pack didn't matter.

P2P1: open As Foretold, Vizier of Remedies, Naga Vitalist, Splendid Agony, Unburden, Shimmerscale Drake. Take Splendid Agony since not willing to venture into blue.
P2P2: Stir the Sands, Watchful Naga, Cursed Minotaur, Hooded Brawler, Magma Spray, Shed Weakness, Evolving Wilds. Take Stir the Sands. No idea how good it is LSV says it's good so I guess ...
P2P3: get passed Glyph Keeper, can't pick it!! In my colours there's Manglehorn, Hooded Brawler, Gift of Paradise, Spidery Grasp and Blighted Bat. I'm tempted by the Gift since it enables a future splash, but one of the creatures should also be good. Without having used either card I like Brawler more than Bat. What would you pick?

EDIT: Well, took the Bat because LSV said so. Rest of the draft was just picking the best black and green cards. There were still decisions, such as whether or not to take Final Reward instead of Gravedigger, but it was reasonably straightforward otherwise. Blue did turn out to be very open but what to do :(

Ended up with this deck:

2 Festering Mummy
2 Shed Weakness
1 Naga Vitalist
1 Bitterblade Warrior
1 Lay Bare The Heart <-- not convinced about this card but LSV said so
1 Miasmic Mummy
1 Bitterblade Warrior
1 Doomed Dissenter
1 Baleful Ammit
1 Splendid Agony
1 Unburden
1 Plague Belcher
2 Blighted Bat
2 Wasteland Scorpion
1 Defiant Greatmaw
1 Bone Picker
2 Horror of the Broken Lands <-- also not convinced about this card without cycling synergies, but LSV said so
1 Final Reward
1 Stir the Sands
1 Greater Sandwurm

7 Forest
8 Swamp
1 Grasping Dunes

Game one I played Miasmic Mummy on turn 2 discarding a land with another land in hand, then wound up not drawing another land for more than ten turns. Meanwhile GW opponent had a nice Cropmate + Cultivator combo going with Fan Bearer backup which let him ramp a little. He had the 4/4 gold card to swing with while tapping my deathtouchers with Fan Bearer, forcing me to Splendid Agony the Fan Bearer. After that the game became a stall until he drew Cartouche of Solidarity, but he was also low (thanks to taking all my Bitterblade Warrior exerts & some hits from Blighted Bat) and I had lots of Doomed Dissenters and Festering Mummies to chump block with. Eventually he couldn't attack anymore. Meanwhile I had cycled Greater Sandwurm to look for lands (was still stuck on three), and then proceed to draw 4-5 lands in a row. Lol! He topdecks Oracle's Vault but then I topdecked Final Reward to kill the 5/5 first strike and attack for the win. Very close game, I was one life away from dying at one point.

Notable cards in sideboard: Pitiless Vizier, 2nd Unburden, Painful Lesson. Would you cut anything for them?


Last edited by Banedon on Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:06 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Dec 19, 2015
Posts: 1623
P1P5 I would've looked at cards in other colours as well; you're not necessarily Green yet.

P1P7 I think Stamina is just a better card than Shed Weakness and it's in the colour you're more likely to play.

Rest of the picks look fine

P2P3: I'd definitely pick Glyph Keeper. You're absolutely not married to your Green yet (you have like what, 10 black and 3 green playables at this point?), and Glyph Keeper is the strongest card by a mile. Even if Blue ends up not working out, you're not missing out on much in this pack.

_________________
My decks can be found in my deckbuilder archive. Enter here!


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:46 am 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 929
Now that I think about it, you're right! With blue turning out to be wide open I think I missed a lot too. Oh well.

Edited the post above, what do you think of the deckbuilding?


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:47 am 
Online
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 25, 2013
Posts: 3348
How would you rank the indestructible angel? I keep skipping it because it seems so slow, but some opponents are playing it.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:21 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Dec 19, 2015
Posts: 1623
Banedon wrote:
2 Festering Mummy
2 Shed Weakness
1 Naga Vitalist
1 Bitterblade Warrior
1 Lay Bare The Heart <-- not convinced about this card but LSV said so
1 Miasmic Mummy
1 Bitterblade Warrior
1 Doomed Dissenter
1 Baleful Ammit
1 Splendid Agony
1 Unburden
1 Plague Belcher
2 Blighted Bat
2 Wasteland Scorpion
1 Defiant Greatmaw
1 Bone Picker
2 Horror of the Broken Lands <-- also not convinced about this card without cycling synergies, but LSV said so
1 Final Reward
1 Stir the Sands
1 Greater Sandwurm

7 Forest
8 Swamp
1 Grasping Dunes


Deck looks okay overall. I personally don't love Lay Bare the Heart as it is a pretty bad topdeck late; would probably run the Painful Lesson over it. You could also consider the Pitiless Vizier over one Festering Mummy; but that's up to preference I think. Don't think I'd run a second Unburden; that card gets clunky in multiples.
Horror is just a good card IMO; a 5 mana 4/4 that can be cycled away for B is already quite good, and this gets better if you have cyclers in hand. Granted, your deck doesn't have a ton of cyclers, but you have a few meaining this is a 4/4 that sometimes grows to a 6/5; perfectly reasonable rate for Limited.


How would you rank the indestructible angel? I keep skipping it because it seems so slow, but some opponents are playing it.


The card's playable, but not at its best in the format; there's a few ways to deal with indestructible threats (exile effects and -1/-1 counters) and the format is rather fast. You can play it if you feel like you lack topend otherwise, but I'd rather not play it (also, there's better top-end fliers in White in Oketra's Attendant and Winged Shepherd)

_________________
My decks can be found in my deckbuilder archive. Enter here!


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:03 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Apr 24, 2017
Posts: 1216
Location: Cucho Lambreta#13992
How would you rank the indestructible angel? I keep skipping it because it seems so slow, but some opponents are playing it.

Angel is a 5-7 pick, is not a bad finisher, demands a very specific answer, it can free block all day, but 7cmc is asking a lot for this format.
I would try to avoid the slow decks in AKH AKH AKH, on HOU HOU AKH it gets better.

_________________
:planeswalker:


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:21 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Feb 29, 2016
Posts: 2780
Location: Portugal
Yeah, I drafted a RB aggro deck today (16 land with curve topping at 4), only got in 2 games but won both.
Nobody seemed to take supernatural stamina so I got 2 of those that have been doing lots of work.
Got lucky and pulled 2 magma sprays and a throne of the god-pharaoh. No bombs though, so if games go long, I could be in a jam. Neheb P1p1 kind of put me into rakdos aggro mode, but I couldn't resist a bit of off-color rare/mythic drafting...(did let a glorious end pass though... Lol)

_________________
Give me land, Give me fire, Give me that which I desire! :mage:
My Duels Youtube Channel


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:34 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Apr 24, 2017
Posts: 1216
Location: Cucho Lambreta#13992
That´s funny... that exact thing happened to me P1P1 Naheb... so I went Minotaur Hellbent
check this board:
Image
I´m 2-1 with it so far.

_________________
:planeswalker:


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:12 pm 
Online
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 25, 2013
Posts: 3348
Got 4 more drafts, one 0-3 WR, a 3-3 BG or UB, can't remember, and another score I can't remember with the other combination, a 6-3 UB and a 7-2 Bg, Maybe it is just the players on arena using more loose cards than usual But black based control seems real, wander in death is an house and miasmic mummy overperforms like crazy, plus stuff like naga oracle, wasteland scorpion, giant spider and soulstinger are just too sweet to recur with wander( or just recurring 2 horrors for the grind, that also works) and you also have the bat as an extra option for something spicy at common. Still haven't needed to run painful lesson since these cards just grind so well for being commons by themselves.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:48 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jul 28, 2015
Posts: 4836
Identity: Male
Preferred Pronoun Set: uhhhhh
I'm avoiding Amonkhet draft because I feel like I don't know the format well enough.

_________________
KLD Season King of the Hill Winner.
EMN Season King of the Hill Winner.

The one true King of NGA Magic Duels on Xbox One.

You want some? Come get some. You don't like me? Bite me.

Day 1,000 of the never-ending Vert monarchy.

viewtopic.php?f=38&t=16077

Magic's a simple game, 2 people take turns playing cards and in the end Divinevert wins 2-0...


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:25 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Nov 10, 2013
Posts: 9791
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
i think Cucho posted some good guides for us

_________________
DCG-MTG wrote:
There's a limited amount of fun to be had in a single game, and this deck will ensure no one has any of it.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:59 am 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 13, 2016
Posts: 929
Thanks for the fixes modulo. Went 7-2. Surprisingly though, the deck felt underpowered. It barely had good late-game. To get past a big creature I basically had only the Sandwurm and Final Reward. Still, I went 7-2 so not complaining.

About to start another run with this build:

2 Seeker of Insight
1 Miasmic Mummy
1 Cartouche of Knowledge
1 Essence Scatter
1 Plague Belcher (opened this P1P1 again)
1 Cursed Minotaur
1 Blighted Bat
1 Unburden
3 Wasteland Scorpion (this might be too many)
1 Cartouche of Ambition
1 Wander in Death
3 Soulstinger
1 Cut // Ribbons (was rare drafting, given that in a previous draft I'd already passed a Canyon Slough I needed for constructed ... gave up a Bone Picker for this)
1 Horror of the Broken Lands
1 Final Reward
1 Never // Return
1 Rags // Riches
1 River Serpent

6 Islands
8 Swamps
1 Mountain
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Fetid Pools

Notable cards not used: Cartouche of Strength, Hekma Sentinels, Floodwaters, Open into Wonder (I have no idea how good this card is), Supernatural Stamina x2, Nest of Scarabs, Painful Lesson x2, Pitiless Vizier x2

Would anyone build this differently?


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group